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Old 08-10-2018, 05:11 PM   #2521
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What I am sick and tired of is being anti-patriotic is the new thing going on the last few years. The main reason why Trump won Was this anti-patriotic momentum that was going on in this country. There’s been a whole lot more anti-Christian And a sudden increase in pro Islamic support at the same time. People are freaking fed up. If this keeps up I’m afraid Trump is going to win again.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:24 PM   #2522
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Originally Posted by imapig View Post
What I am sick and tired of is being anti-patriotic is the new thing going on the last few years. The main reason why Trump won Was this anti-patriotic momentum that was going on in this country. There’s been a whole lot more anti-Christian And a sudden increase in pro Islamic support at the same time. People are freaking fed up. If this keeps up I’m afraid Trump is going to win again.
Oh my god, Kevin. Could you possibly post any more hyperbole?

What anti-Patriotism momentum? I'm sorry, but I sure didn't see what you're describing until this charlatan decided to create false patriotism.

There's more anti-Christian because most people in this country are sick of having it shoved down their throats.

The support is for people who are Islamic and peaceful, not terrorists. I live in a town with the 2nd largest Islamic mosque in NE, I think, and there has never been an incident.

You know what I'm sick to death of? The 1000% increase in the last year of hate crimes against blacks, browns, Jews. And if anyone supports this white nationalistic pervasive racism cloaked in "patriotism" and refuse to recognize it and pretend it doesn't exist, don't fucking talk about patriotism. Because this shit is what is unAmerican.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:57 PM   #2523
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You know what I'm sick to death of? The 1000% increase in the last year of hate crimes against blacks, browns, Jews.
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Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
And if anyone supports this white nationalistic pervasive racism cloaked in "patriotism" and refuse to recognize it and pretend it doesn't exist, don't fucking talk about patriotism. Because this shit is what is unAmerican.
Here's the problem. People who are "white" and support any sense of immigration control are deemed "white nationalists". And since "white nationalist" = "Nazi", white people who want immigration control are Nazis. Of course, this is only new over the last year and a half because we have the video and audio of white (and black) Democrats supporting (what used to be) common sense immigration policy.

If a person dares to think differently than the left's movement over the last eighteen months, they are a "racist", "homophobic", "xenophobic", "sexist" evil person who deserves to be shouted down and assaulted. It isn't some awakening of Nazis that is taking place that needs to be confronted. It is the further demonization of anyone who dares to think differently. After all, how can a person, in good conscience, vote for someone who might be a "racist, homophobic, xenophobic, sexist"?

It's all politics, Lisa. It isn't real.

Do you know what is real? Not a 1000% increase in hate crimes (defined as whites against anyone not white), but the record number of blacks murdered in places like Chicago. "Black lives matter", right? So maybe they should stop killing themselves, then. Protest THAT.
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Old 08-10-2018, 06:42 PM   #2524
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Link?



Here's the problem. People who are "white" and support any sense of immigration control are deemed "white nationalists". And since "white nationalist" = "Nazi", white people who want immigration control are Nazis. Of course, this is only new over the last year and a half because we have the video and audio of white (and black) Democrats supporting (what used to be) common sense immigration policy.

If a person dares to think differently than the left's movement over the last eighteen months, they are a "racist", "homophobic", "xenophobic", "sexist" evil person who deserves to be shouted down and assaulted. It isn't some awakening of Nazis that is taking place that needs to be confronted. It is the further demonization of anyone who dares to think differently. After all, how can a person, in good conscience, vote for someone who might be a "racist, homophobic, xenophobic, sexist"?

It's all politics, Lisa. It isn't real.

Do you know what is real? Not a 1000% increase in hate crimes (defined as whites against anyone not white), but the record number of blacks murdered in places like Chicago. "Black lives matter", right? So maybe they should stop killing themselves, then. Protest THAT.
1000% was rhetorical. The truth is that anti-Semitic, anti-black, anti-Muslim, anti-Latino, anti-native American hate crimes are up significantly, more than significantly, since this administration was put in place.

Yes, it's politics, but it's politics because this administration has "given" them permission.

Example: Yesterday, I was with a friend who is black. She held the door open for a man (a white man), who didn't say "thank you." So after he went through the door she said exactly what I would have said, "You're welcome." This man turned around, looked at her and said "I don't have to say thank you to you. I'm a Trump supporter." And??? So that makes it okay for you to be a rude, ignorant asshole and treat my highly educated black friend like a piece of shit?

This line that you said struck me: "white people who want immigration control are Nazis".

You're not stating it right. White people who support Trump do not want immigration control; they want a full stop to immigration. Everyone else WANTS immigration reform. What everyone else DOESN'T want is what is happening right now. What is happening right now is wrong. It is unAmerican. It is blatant white nationalism. And when all the brown people are gone, because now he's going after them even with legal immigration, then he'll go after the blacks.

Contrary to what you think, the left doesn't have a "movement". The right has the movement. The left is protesting it. Because it's pretty damn disgusting on all fronts. Whether you want to accept it or not, this administration promotes racism, and it has since the day Trump signed on to Bannon's campaign.

Evangelicals are not homophobic, btw. They are just intolerant and hypocritical. They're not in fear of gay people; they're in fear of this country losing its Christianity, and where would that leave them.

You're taking one population of people, Chicago, and analogizing them to all black lives. Chicago is horrific. But they kill each other, and nobody is doing much to stop it, not even the police. And please don't get me wrong...I am the biggest supporter of law enforcement that there is, but I get the mentality of it's too damn dangerous for them to go into certain areas and stop people from killing each other. It happened here years ago in an area that has since been torn down and redeveloped down by the JFK Museum in Dorchester. You know as well as I do that blacks are treated differently in this country. They get tougher and longer sentences, sometimes for misdemeanor crimes that a white person would get off scot free or with probation. They are mistrusted by the police, so police use more force with them. That is what the protests in the NFL are about. That is what the protests from Black Lives Matter stemmed from.

Anti-Semitism has seen a surge. People's houses, places of worship, cars, walls, buildings, swathed with swasticas and SS bolts.

Videos are going viral every single day. Little black girl selling water in front of her house. Police called by a white woman because no permit. Black people with a grill at a public park that allows barbecues have the police called by a white woman screaming at them to leave. A Puerto Rican woman renting an area at a park for her daughter's birthday party being harassed and nearly getting beaten with a cane or a bat by a white man telling her to get out of his country while a LEO stands there doing nothing while she's begging for help.

It's happening more and more.

And we won't even talk about the actual neo-Nazi/white supremacist marches taking place all over the country. One year anniversary for Charlottesville, and these deranged miscreants are having an anniversary celebration instead of having a memorial for the young woman that they killed.

No, I'm not okay with the treatment of someone like Candace Owens, though I don't like her. As far as Sec. Nielsen being chanted to at a Mexican restaurant? I couldn't care less. The woman is a liar and reprehensible. Sarah Sanders? Also a liar and reprehensible because she does it on a daily basis to the American people, but I was against what happened to her at that restaurant.

But the flip side of that is people are angry at being lied to. People are angry at the humanitarian crisis that this administration has created and the treatment of people who need help. And that anger is going to get worse. I was furious yesterday when my that man said that to my friend. I called him every name in the book and loudly, and it could have become a very ugly situation. So I get the anger that people feel.

This isn't okay. And this is becoming rampant. Sorry, T. If you're not seeing it, you're not looking.
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Old 08-10-2018, 06:52 PM   #2525
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I think you guys forgot if I werent for the military we Wouldn’t have any freedom. Hello?


Which has nothing to do with the national anthem. Only via projection.


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Old 08-10-2018, 06:53 PM   #2526
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What I am sick and tired of is being anti-patriotic is the new thing going on the last few years. The main reason why Trump won Was this anti-patriotic momentum that was going on in this country. There’s been a whole lot more anti-Christian And a sudden increase in pro Islamic support at the same time. People are freaking fed up. If this keeps up I’m afraid Trump is going to win again.


Bullshit. Show me this pro Islamic support.
And there’s always been antagonism towards the evangelical right.


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Old 08-10-2018, 07:57 PM   #2527
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Originally Posted by imapig View Post
I think you guys forgot if I werent for the military we Wouldn’t have any freedom. Hello?
No one is shitting on the military. The players have been incredibly clear and consistant about this and there is no reason to not believe them other than the orange goblin saying so.

They protest because they see a situation where America is not rising to the level of it's lofty ideals and they want to draw attention to that. Which is what you do when someone or something you care about isn't living up to it's full potential.

You mentioned freedoms. There is no better way to show appreciation for the freedoms we enjoy than to take advantage of them. Forcing an individual to show fealty to a flag or a song or anything in the name of "freedom" is an excercise in cynicism on a level I can not even fathom.

You should celebrate being fortunate enough to live in country where it's citizens can "disrespect" it publically in front of millions. That is a privilege few have enjoyed historically and shame on us if we don't take advantage of it.
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:01 PM   #2528
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Originally Posted by subroc View Post
The fact that you don't care about your nation or its symbols doesn't mean others don't tells far more about you.
"America" is not the anthem you silly goose.
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Old 08-11-2018, 05:09 AM   #2529
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Originally Posted by imapig View Post
What I am sick and tired of is being anti-patriotic is the new thing going on the last few years. The main reason why Trump won Was this anti-patriotic momentum that was going on in this country. There’s been a whole lot more anti-Christian And a sudden increase in pro Islamic support at the same time. People are freaking fed up. If this keeps up I’m afraid Trump is going to win again.
That's because the country's not 90+% White and/or Christian anymore.

Religion and Patriotism are two different things, by the way. Something else that seems to have gotten conflated, like the NFL and the National Anthem.
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Old 08-11-2018, 05:12 AM   #2530
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Forcing an individual to show fealty to a flag or a song or anything in the name of "freedom" is an excercise in cynicism on a level I can not even fathom.
It is, in fact 'UnConstitutional' (tm BL).

Either the constitution applies, or it doesn't, and if it doesn't, then who is the anti-patriot?
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Old 08-11-2018, 06:44 AM   #2531
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Originally Posted by imapig View Post
What I am sick and tired of is being anti-patriotic is the new thing going on the last few years. The main reason why Trump won Was this anti-patriotic momentum that was going on in this country. There’s been a whole lot more anti-Christian And a sudden increase in pro Islamic support at the same time. People are freaking fed up. If this keeps up I’m afraid Trump is going to win again.
Not really. Trump won because he tapped into a large base of people who confused others' seeking equality as an infringement of their rights. Your statement about "anti-Christian" makes this same mistake.

The irony here is that the anthem protest was largely dead before Trump's inflammatory tweets. Not only to he reignite it, he made kneeling the only viable for the players to show disapproval; anything else would have been granting his position unintended deference. On top of that, Trump's rhetoric gave people who weren't kneeling new reason to do so, to support other players' right to kneel.

IMO, this was no accident. Trump knows he is riding the wave of a triggered right and keeping this issue alive made sure the swell stayed strong

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Old 08-11-2018, 10:04 AM   #2532
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It is, in fact 'UnConstitutional' (tm BL).

Either the constitution applies, or it doesn't, and if it doesn't, then who is the anti-patriot?
I can't think of anything more cynical than forcing someone to celebrate freedom
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Old 08-11-2018, 10:16 AM   #2533
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It isn't a thinking, rational approach. It is emotion-based and highly flawed. And detrimental. And dangerous. And really sad.
TMack, if you get a chance you should check out Jonathan Haidt if you haven't already. I haven't read his new book, but The Righteous Mind does a really good job of explaining the role that emotion plays in our decision making process. Personally I think I have a much better handle on why I think I think the things I think. (Say that a couple times fast)

As to the rest of your post. I think your making "the left" much more monolithic than it actually is (the same could be said about "the right"). There's quite a few of us who also think those people are crazy and wish they'd go away. I'm guessing you probably feel the same about some people on "the right".
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Old 08-11-2018, 02:03 PM   #2534
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Weird to have a president who is basically outing people in his tweet shitstorms. To me, and I may be way off the mark, it seems like when he tweets about people's lovely wives, that it's a semi-dox to let his more rabid supporters know who people's families are.

It's not cool.
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Old 08-11-2018, 02:44 PM   #2535
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Originally Posted by Oswlek View Post
Not really. Trump won because he tapped into a large base of people who confused others' seeking equality as an infringement of their rights. Your statement about "anti-Christian" makes this same mistake...

If that issue was as important as you believe, President Donald John Trump won because of the constant barrage from the left that others need special status in our society that makes them special, not equal. Intersectionality is a classic example. Most believe in equality not special status for groups.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Oswlek View Post
...The irony here is that the anthem protest was largely dead before Trump's inflammatory tweets. Not only to he reignite it, he made kneeling the only viable for the players to show disapproval; anything else would have been granting his position unintended deference. On top of that, Trump's rhetoric gave people who weren't kneeling new reason to do so, to support other players' right to kneel...

Not really. covered up by the media and the NFL to be sure but largely dead? Not by a longshot.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Oswlek View Post
...IMO, this was no accident. Trump knows he is riding the wave of a triggered right and keeping this issue alive made sure the swell stayed strong

This issue is important to many in the United States. His voicing it just indicates the President sides with them, not the other way around.
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Bill Parcells: "You are what your record says you are!"
Margaret Thatcher: "The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money."
President Donald John Trump: "You don't hand matches to an arsonist and you don't give power to an angry left wing mob."

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