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Old 03-17-2018, 06:17 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
This has just about zero to do with the Horowitz investigation, and if it does, the report should be released, which it won't be.

This is a blatant attempt to undermine Mueller's investigation and render McCabe not credible, pure and simple. The president should have absolutely nothing to do with the inner personnel decisions here; yet, he demanded that his spineless weakling of a "recused" AG, who also should have nothing to do with this, fire McCabe.

And his tweets prove exactly the reason why McCabe was fired.

Needless to say, the retaliation/retribution aspect with little more than 24 hours until his pension and benefits became viable is vindictive and disgraceful. This man served for 21 years.

This president is a sick, demented man.
From here.

Quote:
Here’s what we know:

Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced McCabe’s firing in a statement issued at 10 p.m. Friday, just 26 hours before McCabe’s planned retirement:
After an extensive and fair investigation and according to Department of Justice procedure, the Department’s Office of the Inspector General (OIG) provided its report on allegations of misconduct by Andrew McCabe to the FBI’s Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR).

The FBI’s OPR then reviewed the report and underlying documents and issued a disciplinary proposal recommending the dismissal of Mr. McCabe. Both the OIG and FBI OPR reports concluded that Mr. McCabe had made an unauthorized disclosure to the news media and lacked candor—including under oath—on multiple occasions.

The FBI expects every employee to adhere to the highest standards of honesty, integrity, and accountability. As the OPR proposal stated, “all FBI employees know that lacking candor under oath results in dismissal and that our integrity is our brand.”

Pursuant to Department Order 1202, and based on the report of the Inspector General, the findings of the FBI Office of Professional Responsibility, and the recommendation of the Department’s senior career official, I have terminated the employment of Andrew McCabe effective immediately.
A representative for McCabe stated that the deputy director learned of his firing from the press release, though the Justice Department disputes this.

The FBI takes telling the truth extremely seriously: “lack of candor” from employees is a fireable offense—and people are fired for it. Moreover, it doesn’t take an outright lie to be dismissed. In one case, the bureau fired an agent after he initially gave an ambiguous statement to investigators as to how many times he had picked up his daughter from daycare in an FBI vehicle. The U.S. Court of Appeals for the Federal Circuit ruled against the agent when he appealed, finding that “lack of candor is established by showing that the FBI agent did not ‘respond fully and truthfully’ to the questions he was asked.”

Consider also that although Sessions made the ultimate call to fire McCabe, the public record shows that the process resulting in the FBI deputy director’s dismissal involved career Justice Department and FBI officials—rather than political appointees selected by President Trump—at crucial points along the way. To begin with, the charges against McCabe arose out of the broader Justice Department Office of Inspector General (OIG) investigation into the FBI’s handling of the Clinton email investigation. While the inspector general is appointed by the president, the current head of that office, Michael Horowitz, was appointed by President Barack Obama and is himself a former career Justice Department lawyer. As Jack Goldsmith has written, the inspector general has a great deal of statutory independence, which Horowitz has not hesitated to use: Most notably, he produced a highly critical 2012 report into the Justice Department’s “Fast and Furious” program. So a process that begins with Horowitz and his office carries a presumption of fairness and independence.

After investigating McCabe, Horowitz’s office provided a report on McCabe’s conduct to the FBI’s Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR), which investigates allegations of misconduct against bureau employees. This office is headed by career Justice Department official Candace Will, whom then-FBI Director Robert Mueller appointed to lead the OPR in 2004. According to Sessions, the Office of Professional Responsibility agreed with Horowitz’s assessment that McCabe “lacked candor” in speaking to internal investigators.

Finally, Sessions’s statement references “the recommendation of the Department’s senior career official” in advocating McCabe’s firing on the basis of the OIG and OPR determinations. (The official in question appears to be Associate Deputy Attorney General Scott Schools.)

So while Sessions made the decision to dismiss McCabe, career officials or otherwise independent actors were involved in conducting the investigation into the deputy director and recommending his dismissal on multiple levels.

As Sessions frames it, McCabe was dismissed for lacking candor when speaking to investigators on the matter of an “unauthorized disclosure to the news media.”
So we are left with the following situation.

Either Sessions lied through his teeth of his statements were accurate.

Since he claims that multiple career DOJ officials did very specific things, it seems to me that if he's lying that will come out very quickly.

BTW, I'm looking forward to someone on the left, not necessarily here, explain why not being honest with the FBI/DOJ isn't such a big deal. I'm sure the various people who have plead guilty to that in the Mueller investigation will be happy to know that.
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Old 03-17-2018, 07:11 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O_P_T View Post

From here.

So we are left with the following situation.

Either Sessions lied through his teeth of his statements were accurate.

Since he claims that multiple career DOJ officials did very specific things, it seems to me that if he's lying that will come out very quickly.

BTW, I'm looking forward to someone on the left, not necessarily here, explain why not being honest with the FBI/DOJ isn't such a big deal. I'm sure the various people who have plead guilty to that in the Mueller investigation will be happy to know that.
Sessions has lied under oath to Congress. Why would I think he wouldn't lie about everything else.

It is a huge deal to lie to federal law enforcement officials and to our federal attorneys. I'm quite certain that in the end anyone who does so is exposed.

Someone probably should have explained that to Don Jr and Jared.

The fact remains that (1) Sessions is recused from anything having to do with the campaign and ethically doesn't have the authority to fire McCabe, though he has no ethics, and (2) the timing is nothing more than vindictive and retaliatory, (3) the report should have been made public before the firing.

When was the report in hand? A week ago? A month ago? Six months ago? I'm pretty sure it wasn't handed to Sessions on a Friday night. What is true is that this wasn't up to Sessions at all. Trump gave him the ultimatum: fire him or I'm firing you.

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Old 03-17-2018, 08:40 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
Sessions has lied under oath to Congress. Why would I think he wouldn't lie about everything else.

It is a huge deal to lie to federal law enforcement officials and to our federal attorneys. I'm quite certain that in the end anyone who does so is exposed.

Someone probably should have explained that to Don Jr and Jared.

The fact remains that (1) Sessions is recused from anything having to do with the campaign and ethically doesn't have the authority to fire McCabe, though he has no ethics, and (2) the timing is nothing more than vindictive and retaliatory, (3) the report should have been made public before the firing.

When was the report in hand? A week ago? A month ago? Six months ago? I'm pretty sure it wasn't handed to Sessions on a Friday night. What is true is that this wasn't up to Sessions at all. Trump gave him the ultimatum: fire him or I'm firing you.
Trump advertised his intentions by tweet months ago. Naked and obvious politics.

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Old 03-17-2018, 10:01 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
This has just about zero to do with the Horowitz investigation, and if it does, the report should be released, which it won't be.

This is a blatant attempt to undermine Mueller's investigation and render McCabe not credible, pure and simple. The president should have absolutely nothing to do with the inner personnel decisions here; yet, he demanded that his spineless weakling of a "recused" AG, who also should have nothing to do with this, fire McCabe.

And his tweets prove exactly the reason why McCabe was fired.

Needless to say, the retaliation/retribution aspect with little more than 24 hours until his pension and benefits became viable is vindictive and disgraceful. This man served for 21 years.

This president is a sick, demented man.
McCabe was fired by Sessions, at the recommendation of the OPR, based on Horowitz's information provided to them.

He lied to a federal investigator under oath, he leaked information about an investigation to the press, and he attempted to influence a judge on the FISA court regarding a case being brought before the judge.

There is likely more remaining classified for the time being, but that is what we know from his walking papers.

Simple as that.
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Old 03-17-2018, 10:18 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
Sessions has lied under oath to Congress. Why would I think he wouldn't lie about everything else.
He did?

From Factcheck.org

Quote:
But legal experts say it would be difficult to prosecute a perjury charge against Sessions, given the ambiguity of the context of his statement.

According to federal law, perjury is committed when one is under oath and “willfully subscribes as true any material matter which he does not believe to be true.”

“The thing about perjury is there can’t be any room for ambiguity, confusion or uncertainty,” said Randall Eliason, who teaches white collar criminal law at George Washington University Law School and is a former assistant U.S. attorney for the District of Columbia, where he served as chief of the public corruption/government fraud section. “Because you’ve got to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that a person knowingly and intentionally said something that they did not believe to be true.”

Being evasive or cagey isn’t the same thing as telling a lie and committing perjury, Eliason told us.

“There is enough wiggle room that makes a perjury prosecution [against Sessions] difficult,” Eliason said. Unless there is some bombshell, he said, such as emails or notes from the conversation that suggest Sessions was acting in his role as a campaign surrogate, “I don’t see it as a criminal case.”

We agree that there may be some ambiguity about Sessions’ response in the confirmation hearing, and whether or not he intentionally misled senators. And so we’ll leave it up to readers to make up their own minds about that. And we will update this piece should new information emerge.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
The fact remains that (1) Sessions is recused from anything having to do with the campaign and ethically doesn't have the authority to fire McCabe, though he has no ethics,
No, Sessions is recused from the Russia investigation, the firing of McCabe has nothing to do with that, based on Sessions statement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFanLisa View Post
When was the report in hand? A week ago? A month ago? Six months ago? I'm pretty sure it wasn't handed to Sessions on a Friday night. What is true is that this wasn't up to Sessions at all. Trump gave him the ultimatum: fire him or I'm firing you.
Indeed, so you know this as a fact? You claim it is "true" after all.

Perhaps you should consider differentiating what is your opinion from what is "fact".

Or do you claim to advocate your own brand of "alternate facts"?

Look, if that's your opinion, that's fine. All I'm asking is that you express it as such.

Otherwise, you give no reason for anyone to think you stating an "actual" fact as being anything other than opinion.

And please, don't embarrass yourself by claiming "of course it's an opinion".

You know as well as I do, how to parse a phrase to clearly state if something is opinion or of we believe it to be fact.

That was a statement of fact.
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Old 03-18-2018, 07:15 AM   #21
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Know why Sessions had to recuse, right? Couldn't manage to tell the truth about meeting with Russians.

He won't admit that is lying, but yeah...

Sessions 'was not completely forthcoming', and that was what he trotted out to purge McCabe with.

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Old 03-18-2018, 07:38 AM   #22
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Apparently only a few of us read the president's tweets. He actually tweeted that the Attorney General should FIRE McCabe or risk his own job.

And, no, I'm not going back through his numerous ridiculous tweets to find it.

He lied to congress about his meeting with Kislyak.
He is recused from anything to do with Russia, including during the campaign.
Being "prosecuted" for lying to congress is a different animal than lying to congress, the whole world knows it, and getting away with it because nobody has charged him, at least as of now.

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Old 03-18-2018, 07:40 AM   #23
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Interesting stuff there .
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Old 03-18-2018, 08:32 AM   #24
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Trump has established the 'bow to my whims or I'll fire you' precedent. Horowitz sees where failing Dear Leader leads...

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Old 03-18-2018, 09:23 AM   #25
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Comey testified under oath he'd never authorized Trump or Clinton leaks. McCabe said leak for which he was fired was authorized by Comey. Ruh roh.
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Old 03-18-2018, 09:25 AM   #26
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Comey testified under oath he'd never authorized Trump or Clinton leaks. McCabe said leak for which he was fired was authorized by Comey. Ruh roh.
Which leak?

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Old 03-18-2018, 11:00 AM   #27
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Quote:
Exclusive: Sources contradict Sessions' testimony he opposed Russia outreach

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions’ testimony that he opposed a proposal for President Donald Trump’s 2016 campaign team to meet with Russians has been contradicted by three people who told Reuters they have spoken about the matter to investigators with Special Counsel Robert Mueller or congressional committees.

Sessions testified before Congress in November 2017 that he “pushed back” against the proposal made by former campaign adviser George Papadopoulos at a March 31, 2016 campaign meeting. Then a senator from Alabama, Sessions chaired the meeting as head of the Trump campaign’s foreign policy team.

“Yes, I pushed back,” Sessions told the House Judiciary Committee on Nov. 14, when asked whether he shut down Papadopoulos’ proposed outreach to Russia. Sessions has since also been interviewed by Mueller.

Three people who attended the March campaign meeting told Reuters they gave their version of events to FBI agents or congressional investigators probing Russian interference in the 2016 election. Although the accounts they provided to Reuters differed in certain respects, all threes, who declined to be identified, said Sessions had expressed no objections to Papadopoulos’ idea.

However, another meeting attendee, J.D. Gordon, who was the Trump campaign’s director of national security, told media outlets including Reuters in November that Sessions strongly opposed Papadopoulos’ proposal and said no one should speak of it again. In response to a request for comment, Gordon said on Saturday that he stood by his statement.

Sessions, through Justice Department spokeswoman Sarah Isgur Flores, declined to comment beyond his prior testimony. The special counsel’s office also declined to comment. Spokeswomen for the Democrats and Republicans on the House Judiciary Committee did not immediately comment.

Reuters was unable to determine whether Mueller is probing discrepancies in accounts of the March 2016 meeting.

The three accounts, which have not been reported, raise new questions about Sessions’ testimony regarding contacts with Russia during the campaign.

Sessions previously failed to disclose to Congress meetings he had with former Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak, and testified in October that he was not aware of any campaign representatives communicating with Russians.

Some Democrats have seized on discrepancies in Sessions’ testimony to suggest the attorney general may have committed perjury. A criminal charge would require showing Sessions intended to deceive. Sessions told the House Judiciary Committee that he had always told the truth and testified to the best of his recollection.

Legal experts expressed mixed views about the significance of the contradictions cited by the three sources.

Sessions could argue he misremembered events or perceived his response in a different way, making any contradictions unintentional, some experts said.

Jonathan Turley, a law professor at George Washington University, said Sessions’ words might be too vague to form the basis of a perjury case because there could be different interpretations of what the term pushing back means.

“If you’re talking about false statements, prosecutors look for something that is concrete and clear,” he said.

Other legal experts said, however, that repeated misstatements by Sessions could enable prosecutors to build a perjury case against him.

“Proving there was intent to lie is a heavy burden for the prosecution. But now you have multiple places where Sessions has arguably made false statements,” said Bennett Gershman, a Pace University law professor.

The March 2016 campaign meeting in Washington was memorialized in a photo Trump posted on Instagram of roughly a dozen men sitting around a table, including Trump, Sessions and Papadopoulos.

Papadopoulos, who pleaded guilty in October to lying to the Federal Bureau of Investigation about his Russia contacts, is now cooperating with Mueller.

According to court documents released after his guilty plea, Papadopoulos said at the campaign meeting that he had connections who could help arrange a meeting between Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Papadopoulos continued to pursue Russian contacts after the March 2016 meeting and communicated with some campaign officials about his efforts, according to the court documents.

Trump has said that he does not remember much of what happened at the “very unimportant” campaign meeting. Trump has said he did not meet Putin before becoming president.

Moscow has denied meddling in the election and Trump has denied his campaign colluded with Russia.

Reporting by Karen Freifeld, Sarah N. Lynch and Mark Hosenball; Additional reporting by Jonathan Landay in Washington and Jan Wolfe in New York; Editing by Anthony Lin, Noeleen Walder and Jeffrey Benkoe

Our Standards:The Thomson Reuters Trust Principles.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN1GU0NC
Sounds a lot like "lack of candor", doesn't it?

An honest man.

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Old 03-18-2018, 12:45 PM   #28
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The Swamp is in full RED ALERT mode...

Brennan is panicking.
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Old 03-18-2018, 01:24 PM   #29
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Over what?
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Old 03-19-2018, 09:47 AM   #30
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Eagle River, Ak
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AkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really nice
AkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really niceAkPatsFan is just really nice
Good riddance to McCabe, he didn't deserve a pension and has no honor, lying pos.
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