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Old 10-21-2019, 12:25 PM   #706
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.Z.O. View Post
they most certainly are not.



Catholics believe in-



- purgatory

- salvation through works and confession

- the divinity of man (saints, the Pope, Mary)

- celibacy of clergy



If you've read the NT and actually paid attention to and understood what you read (not being accusatory, using YOU in a general sense here) you would see that all of that flies in direct opposition to what Jesus, Paul and Peter taught. On top of that, Catholics added their own chapters to the Bible. Catholics were the ones that fought the printing of the Bible in common language.


I’m well versed in Biblical and more importantly Christian history.
Catholicism is the oldest organized Church. Peter was the first Pope.
Constantine and his Nicaean Creed are part of the Catholic Faith.
Catholics do NOT believe in the divinity of saints, the Pope, or Mary. No idea where that came from.

There are arguments for Christians being believers in Purgatory as early as the first and second centuries AD. Pope Gregory certainly made it more explicit, but there’s plenty of evidence of this concept in the earliest days of the church.

No Protestant sect can claim to be “original”, as they all split under Luther and others in the 16th century.


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Old 10-21-2019, 12:28 PM   #707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFan09 View Post
I’m well versed in Biblical and more importantly Christian history.
Catholicism is the oldest organized Church. Peter was the first Pope.
Constantine and his Nicaean Creed are part of the Catholic Faith.
Catholics do NOT believe in the divinity of saints, the Pope, or Mary. No idea where that came from.

There are arguments for Christians being believers in Purgatory as early as the first and second centuries AD. Pope Gregory certainly made it more explicit, but there’s plenty of evidence of this concept in the earliest days of the church.

No Protestant sect can claim to be “original”, as they all split under Luther and others in the 16th century.


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Think of purgatory as "the big timeout",

Cheers
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:41 PM   #708
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.Z.O. View Post
Love you to death my friend but, as an atheist, your understanding of faith stops at the edge of simple religion and you look at this from a strictly intellectual level. In Galatians, Paul warned believers to beware of those who attempted to attach rules taken from OT law to the Gospel as he was teaching it. None of the rules, ceremonies, or whatever else it is that Catholics do has anything to do with the Gospels in their truest form.
Well, my definition of Christian is a belief that Christ is the messiah. Catholics fit that description.

Just my 2 pennies.
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:54 PM   #709
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PatsFan09 View Post
I’m well versed in Biblical and more importantly Christian history.
Catholicism is the oldest organized Church. Peter was the first Pope.
Constantine and his Nicaean Creed are part of the Catholic Faith.
Catholics do NOT believe in the divinity of saints, the Pope, or Mary. No idea where that came from.

There are arguments for Christians being believers in Purgatory as early as the first and second centuries AD. Pope Gregory certainly made it more explicit, but there’s plenty of evidence of this concept in the earliest days of the church.

No Protestant sect can claim to be “original”, as they all split under Luther and others in the 16th century.


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I have family members who are Catholic- they believe in the divinity of saints, Mary and the Pope. They pray to them. They also believe in purgatory and salvation through works and confession. Peter never held the title of Pope, Catholics credit it to him based on Christ saying "upon this rock I will build my church" in Matthew...want to say 16.

You won't win this argument with me, I have far too much real life experience to be swayed from my stance. Don't tell me that something isn't when I've seen numerous times in person that it is.
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Old 10-21-2019, 02:59 PM   #710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.Z.O. View Post
Love you to death my friend but, as an atheist, your understanding of faith stops at the edge of simple religion and you look at this from a strictly intellectual level. In Galatians, Paul warned believers to beware of those who attempted to attach rules taken from OT law to the Gospel as he was teaching it. None of the rules, ceremonies, or whatever else it is that Catholics do has anything to do with the Gospels in their truest form.
The Gospels in their truest form are something we do not have...not even close. We don't even have copies of copies of copies (times a large number) of the original. All the Gospel truly is are the record of Jesus's life and teachings as told by 4 men who served him, and have been rewritten and translated umpteenyrandobignumber times over the past 2000 years. Never mind the Gospel consists of only the writings of 4 of his 12 apostles and none of his other 70 or 72 disciples spoken about in Eastern Christianity or any of the hundreds of followers and devotees of the times...just know that even these were cherry picked by the church long ago by....you guessed it, the Catholic Church you deride in your prior few posts.

I always get a kick out of the overbearing nature of biblical literalists and their audacity when it comes to their opinion of Judaism and Catholicism...the very religions that spawned theirs.
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Old 10-21-2019, 03:02 PM   #711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IU_Knightmare View Post
The Gospels in their truest form are something we do not have...not even close. We don't even have copies of copies of copies (times a large number) of the original. All the Gospel truly is are the record of Jesus's life and teachings as told by 4 men who served him, and have been rewritten and translated umpteenyrandobignumber times over the past 2000 years. Never mind the Gospel consists of only the writings of 4 of his 12 apostles and none of his other 70 or 72 disciples spoken about in Eastern Christianity or any of the hundreds of followers and devotees of the times...just know that even these were cherry picked by the church long ago by....you guessed it, the Catholic Church you deride in your prior few posts.



I always get a kick out of the overbearing nature of biblical literalists and their audacity when it comes to their opinion of Judaism and Catholicism...the very religions that spawned theirs.
The Gnostic texts are fascinating.

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Old 10-21-2019, 05:29 PM   #712
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.Z.O. View Post
I have family members who are Catholic- they believe in the divinity of saints, Mary and the Pope. They pray to them. They also believe in purgatory and salvation through works and confession. Peter never held the title of Pope, Catholics credit it to him based on Christ saying "upon this rock I will build my church" in Matthew...want to say 16.



You won't win this argument with me, I have far too much real life experience to be swayed from my stance. Don't tell me that something isn't when I've seen numerous times in person that it is.


Yeah, well, I’ve studied Catholicism and Christianity for decades.
Clearly you don’t understand that praying to saints isn’t to them specifically; it’s asking saints to intercede with God.
Saints have no divine power.
Born and raised Catholic, now an agnostic, , have a Masters in Roman History as well as 3/4ths of my PhD completed in Roman history. I know far more about this topic than most.


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Old 10-31-2019, 08:01 AM   #713
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COLUMBIA, S.C. (AP) — A Roman Catholic priest’s denial of communion to Joe Biden in South Carolina on Sunday illustrates the fine line presidential candidates must walk as they talk about their faiths: balancing religious values with a campaign that asks them to choose a side in polarizing moral debates.

The awkward moment for Biden came during a weekend campaign swing through South Carolina, a pivotal firewall in his hopes to claim the Democratic presidential nomination. The former vice president on Sunday visited St. Anthony Catholic Church in Florence, a midsize city in the state’s largely rural northeast. As he frequently does on the trail, Biden — a lifelong Catholic — made a stop at a local parish, attending services without the press before stopping at other churches with reporters.


https://apnews.com/346d1f931c6146c097f6516ee00dfbb2

Reminds me of when he went to the barbecue festival right after leaving that "stop eating meat to save the planet" summit.

BY the way...how is Joe's "just because you don't like it, shut up and swallow it, and vote for me anyway"" campaign going with the primary voters?
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Who is this self-important instigating douche-bag, anyway?
Dude, Baron has been a valued member of this forum for quite some time.
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Old 10-31-2019, 12:30 PM   #714
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Joe “Trump can’t use his office to investigate legit corruption, though I can use the office for corrupt purposes” Biden?

Not well.

Whistleblower is landing right in his lap.
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Old 10-31-2019, 01:29 PM   #715
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Joe “Trump can’t use his office to investigate legit corruption, though I can use the office for corrupt purposes” Biden?

Not well.

Whistleblower is landing right in his lap.
He must be hoping the whistleblower is a 10 year old girl.
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Old 10-31-2019, 01:30 PM   #716
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Gabbard voted in favor of this impeachment thingy.
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Old 10-31-2019, 03:55 PM   #717
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Gabbard voted in favor of this impeachment thingy.
Political suicide if she falls out of line.

Was it unanimous on the Dem side? If not, is there a list of nay voters?
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Old 10-31-2019, 05:22 PM   #718
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Political suicide if she falls out of line.

Was it unanimous on the Dem side? If not, is there a list of nay voters?
It was not unanimous, but I don't have the list.
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Old 10-31-2019, 05:34 PM   #719
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Political suicide if she falls out of line.

Was it unanimous on the Dem side? If not, is there a list of nay voters?
2 Dem nays:

Reps. Jeff Van Drew, a New Jersey freshman, and veteran Collin Peterson of Minnesota,

Cheers
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Old 10-31-2019, 06:13 PM   #720
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79 of the House Dems came from 21 states Trump won, by a margin of 13.77%

Buh-bye!

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