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Old 04-18-2017, 01:33 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HSanders View Post
Tennessee Titan DT Jurrell Casey quoted by PFT TV show this morning on teammate RB Derrick Henry not showing up for voluntary unpaid OTAs:
"It puts that little checkmark in the back of my mind and lets me know who I can count on and can't count on. You want to see your teammates show up."

It can put doubt in some guys minds. In a team sport, that's a killer, IMO.
I'd have an issue with Henry not showing up for team work outs. He's putting the 'I' before the 'team' after he became a team member.
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Old 04-18-2017, 06:16 PM   #32
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@spacecrime,
Regular 9-5ers aren't in the same position.
That's why I used military in my comparison, working as a unit,success depends on it.
I don't mind when guys leave their teams for money. I don't expect that type of loyalty to team, fans etc . I exepect they are as one with their teammates on the team they are on, that's all. It's about the team functioning as a unit, not about, well I like these guys and this team so I can't leave for more money. It's a mentality, just like how these guys can make themselves play through godawful injuries so the don't lose their jobs/let their teammates down.
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"That number doesn't mean anything."


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Old 04-21-2017, 01:58 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O.Z.O. View Post
O.Z.O. Jr's best friend since 4th grade is at Stanford on a full ride. McCaffery told the entire team he wouldn't be playing in the bowl game and told them why. That included the coaching staff. Every one of them fully supported his decision. He was in a position where an injury could have potentially cost him 10M...every one of them realized that it could potentially be the same thing with them. If it didn't bother his teammates or coaches, it shouldn't bother fans.
I would do the exact same thing...
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Old 04-21-2017, 06:58 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HSanders View Post
Obviously, football isn't the services, but a similar mentality is needed as far as working as one unit. A guy who doesn't want to do combine stuff is one thing, but a guy who refuses to play with his teammates in the postseason is revolting. He simply can't be counted on to be a good teammate i.m.o.
I don't have a problem with guys being individuals, but they must also make some sacrifices for the team. I guarantee you that when salaries were small, this wouldn't happen. I don't begrudge guys their market values at all. I am just sad about what it has done to the sport.
If I had been one of his Stanford teammates, I would have understood him sitting out, and encouraged him to, especially considering they were not in the playoffs.
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Old 04-21-2017, 08:04 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by HSanders View Post
@spacecrime,
Regular 9-5ers aren't in the same position.
That's why I used military in my comparison, working as a unit,success depends on it.
I agree that when they are in a game or in a battle, teamwork is important. But if one team member doesn't make a game or a mission, the next man takes his place. Games and missions don't fail to happen. That's how a team is greater than the individual. An individual can depart and the team goes on. Soldiers go on leave for any number of reasons, even before big missions, and life goes on.

But this isn't about the game or the team, it's a business decision to protect his future earnings.
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Old 04-22-2017, 08:29 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spacecrime View Post
I agree that when they are in a game or in a battle, teamwork is important. But if one team member doesn't make a game or a mission, the next man takes his place. Games and missions don't fail to happen. That's how a team is greater than the individual. An individual can depart and the team goes on. Soldiers go on leave for any number of reasons, even before big missions, and life goes on.

But this isn't about the game or the team, it's a business decision to protect his future earnings.
I understand his motivation completely and I can't say I wouldn't do the same. But if I did I think I'd feel selfish & shamed of myself choosing me over my team.


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Old 04-22-2017, 01:30 PM   #37
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I understand his motivation completely and I can't say I wouldn't do the same. But if I did I think I'd feel selfish & shamed of myself choosing me over my team.


Cheers
Once you're under contract with certain guarantees in place, I would be all for the team.
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Old 04-25-2017, 11:15 AM   #38
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If I had been one of his Stanford teammates, I would have understood him sitting out, and encouraged him to, especially considering they were not in the playoffs.
That's exactly what they did. Even the coaching staff.
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Old 04-25-2017, 04:13 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by spacecrime View Post
I agree that when they are in a game or in a battle, teamwork is important. But if one team member doesn't make a game or a mission, the next man takes his place. Games and missions don't fail to happen. That's how a team is greater than the individual. An individual can depart and the team goes on. Soldiers go on leave for any number of reasons, even before big missions, and life goes on.

But this isn't about the game or the team, it's a business decision to protect his future earnings.
You make compelling and convincing points for sure. This decision of his hits me in my atavistic side more than my intellectual side though.

To all of those who are fine with this (IOW, everyone but me):
how do you feel about a guy dogging it while he's in a contract year so he won't get hurt and preserve himself for FA? Is this just a matter of professional vs. soon to be pro to you? Or something else?
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"Coach [Bill] Belichick always used to say, 'I don't give a s--- about our defense giving up yards; all I care about is scoring defense, turnovers and the red zone,'" Woody said. "That's really the key to football. A lot of coaches pound their chest and say, 'I've got the No. 1 defense.'
"That number doesn't mean anything."


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Old 04-25-2017, 06:43 PM   #40
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Old 04-25-2017, 06:55 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by HSanders View Post
To all of those who are fine with this (IOW, everyone but me):
how do you feel about a guy dogging it while he's in a contract year so he won't get hurt and preserve himself for FA? Is this just a matter of professional vs. soon to be pro to you? Or something else?
Generally I see players playing hard in a contract year. It is the year after the c ontract that I don't like players dogging it, for the same reason you don't like McCaffrey and Fournette: they are letting the team down.

What I don't care about is if a player doesn't want to play in preseason. I know it is still a team, but I don't see dogging it in the preseason to avoid injury in the same light of a real game.

I guess that also sums up my feeling about bowl games, which I see as exhibition games. If a player refused to play a game during the season I'd feel differently, but still not nearly as much as a pro player. For me the difference is MONEY. A pro player has a contract and a job. A college kid is playing a game with friends. Pay the college kid like the pros and I will re-think my position.

This really isn't an issue for logical arguments. It really is a reflection of how we all feel in sum of a lot of things. I don't see an absolute right or wrong, but I understand how you feel and how I feel. We both just bring different things to the table, like the first pick in the draft and Mr. Irrelevant.
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