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Old 03-28-2020, 05:01 PM   #646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
First off, the media has severely played this out as a nuclear explosion on American soil which is why 2/3 of the people in this country are stuck at home, not working and wondering when the FUCK the Toilet paper is coming back...
Yeah, but that same MSM spent most of February downplaying it as cited here.

Quote:
First, a quick refresher on how the media botched the initial coverage: On Jan. 23, authorities in Beijing sealed off Wuhan, a city of 11 million in China’s interior, to contain the virus. Much of the media response was to downplay this harbinger of the deadly global threat to come. “Don’t worry about the coronavirus,” BuzzFeed wrote on Jan. 29. Worry about the flu.” On Jan. 31 – the same day the Trump administration imposed a ban incoming visitors from China – the “explainer” news site Vox was telling readers, “Is this going to be a deadly pandemic? No.” On Feb. 1, the Washington Post ran an article headlined, “Get a grippe, America. The flu is a much bigger threat than coronavirus, for now.” On Groundhog Day, the Post was saying, “Past epidemics prove fighting coronavirus with travel bans is a mistake.”

By Feb. 3, China had extended the quarantine to 50 million people and imposed a travel ban on 16 cities. Now the Washington Post was worried, but about government’s response, not the virus, writing a critical story with the headline “Why we should be wary of an aggressive government response to coronavirus.” The complaint was that harsh measures “scapegoat already marginalized populations” and that the Trump administration’s travel ban on noncitizens coming from China “marks a significant, and potentially counterproductive, escalation in the U.S. response to the coronavirus crisis.”

On Feb. 7, The Daily Beast was saying, “Coronavirus, with zero American fatalities, is dominating headlines, while the flu is the real threat.” As late as March 4, CNN’s Anderson Cooper was telling viewers, “So if you’re freaked out at all about the coronavirus, you should be more concerned about the flu.” (The media has come full circle on the comparisons to the seasonal flu – on Tuesday the Washington Post was fretting, “Trump again downplays coronavirus by comparing it to the seasonal flu.” Media, heal thyself!)

In retrospect, it’s hard to deny the mainstream media’s initial downplaying of the threat was very wrong, or that it was partly a result of kneejerk antipathy to the Trump administration’s travel ban – which in retrospect looks like a prescient move.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
Also, stop comparing this to the flu. It's not the Flu. You guys are comparing a Corvette to a Station Wagon, FFS.
You keep saying that, why?

Why isn't it correct to compare this to the flu?

Both are transmitted in a very similar manner.

Both produce very similar symptoms.

The flu kills 10's of thousands of Americans every year.

Each year it is a slightly different strain of the flu, so you comment about the Cornovirus being "new" and the flu being around for "a long time" is simply wrong.

Yes, this particular strain is "new", but so are all the different strains of the flu that crop up year after year.

Is it that the COVID-19 statistics are only based on the denominator being those who have tested positive, where as the flu is calculated using a mathematical model based on hospitalizations?

Quote:
What does the cumulative burden of influenza for the 2019-2020 season mean?
The cumulative burden of influenza is an estimate of the number of people who have been sick, seen a healthcare provider, been hospitalized, or died as a result of influenza since October 01, 2018. CDC does not know the exact number of people who have been sick and affected by influenza because influenza is not a reportable disease in most areas of the United States. However, these numbers are estimated using a mathematical model, based on observed rates of laboratory-confirmed influenza-associated hospitalizations.

How does CDC estimate the cumulative burden of seasonal influenza?
Preliminary estimates of the cumulative burden of seasonal influenza during the 2019-2020 season in the United States are based on crude rates of laboratory-confirmed influenza-associated hospitalizations, reported through the Influenza Hospitalization Surveillance Network (FluSurv-NET), which were adjusted for the frequency of influenza testing during recent prior seasons and the sensitivity of influenza diagnostic assays. Rates of hospitalization were then multiplied by previously estimated ratio of hospitalizations to symptomatic illnesses, and frequency of seeking medical care to calculate symptomatic illnesses, medical visits, and deaths associated with seasonal influenza, respectively.
If that's your beef, well then yeah, I agree the mortality and # of infected stats can't be compared, as I have said repeatedly.
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Old 03-28-2020, 05:24 PM   #647
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight Schrute View Post
You keep making claims like this but you simply don’t know. Nobody knows how many are walking around a symptomatic.

Read this:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wsj...ay-11585088464

Fvck!

It’s a pay site. I read but when I tried to copy and paste it stopped me. Anyone that could grab it much appreciated.
I couldn't get past the paywall, but there is an article here that quotes some of the Op-Ed.

Quote:
Two professors of medicine at Stanford University published an opinion article Tuesday in the Wall Street Journal, suggesting there is little evidence that the coronavirus would kill millions of people without shelter-in-place orders and quarantines.

“Fear of Covid-19 is based on its high estimated case fatality rate—2% to 4% of people with confirmed Covid-19 have died, according to the World Health Organization and others,” the article, headlined "Is the Coronavirus as Deadly as They Say?" and written by Dr. Eran Bendavid and Dr. Jay Bhattacharya, reads. “So if 100 million Americans ultimately get the disease, two million to four million could die. We believe that estimate is deeply flawed. The true fatality rate is the portion of those infected who die, not the deaths from identified positive cases.”

The deaths from identified positive cases are “misleading” because of limited data, according to the professors.

“If the number of actual infections is much larger than the number of cases—orders of magnitude larger—then the true fatality rate is much lower as well. That’s not only plausible but likely based on what we know so far,” the professors argued.

The professors cited data from Iceland, China, the United States, and Italy, which is arguably the hardest-hit region when it comes to the coronavirus.

“On March 6, all 3,300 people of Vò were tested, and 90 were positive, a prevalence of 2.7%,” the professors said. “Applying that prevalence to the whole province (population 955,000), which had 198 reported cases, suggests there were actually 26,000 infections at that time. That’s more than 130-fold the number of actual reported cases. Since Italy’s case fatality rate of 8% is estimated using the confirmed cases, the real fatality rate could in fact be closer to 0.06%.”

The professors argued that current epidemiological models aren’t adequate for two key reasons.

“First, the test used to identify cases doesn’t catch people who were infected and recovered. Second, testing rates were woefully low for a long time and typically reserved for the severely ill. Together, these facts imply that the confirmed cases are likely orders of magnitude less than the true number of infections,” it reads.

Ultimately, while stressing the seriousness of the virus that has infected almost half a million people, the professors aren’t convinced a universal quarantine is the most logical course of action.

“A universal quarantine may not be worth the costs it imposes on the economy, community and individual mental and physical health,” the article concluded. “We should undertake immediate steps to evaluate the empirical basis of the current lockdowns.”

Co-author Bhattacharya spoke with the Washington Examiner and elaborated on the main message of the article.

“The main message my colleagues and I want to get across is that the facts to date are consistent with a tremendous range of uncertainty regarding the fatality rate from COVID-19,” Bhattacharya said. “We desperately need a population-representative estimate of the seroprevalence of the disease so we can reduce that uncertainty and make better policy on the basis of our improved knowledge. Such a study would not be too expensive and is feasible to run immediately.”

More than 15,000 people have died from the coronavirus, with more than 100,000 recoveries, according to John Hopkins University data.
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Old 03-28-2020, 05:34 PM   #648
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To aid corona virus testing, Nancy Pelosi asks all Americans to cooperate regardless of party affiliations
1 week ago

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi says, “There is not a day to lose,” in this fight against the dreaded corona virus plague.

Pelosi is spearheading a new initiative to help get everyone in the country tested for the disease using a new unobtrusive testing procedure.

“It’s a very simple test and requires very little on the part of each individual citizen,” Pelosi said at a conference announcing the initiative. “All you have to do is send a stool sample to my office in Washington.

Honorable Nancy Pelosi
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Last edited by BostonTim; 03-28-2020 at 05:43 PM..
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Old 03-28-2020, 06:09 PM   #649
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BostonTim View Post
To aid corona virus testing, Nancy Pelosi asks all Americans to cooperate regardless of party affiliations
1 week ago

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi says, “There is not a day to lose,” in this fight against the dreaded corona virus plague.

Pelosi is spearheading a new initiative to help get everyone in the country tested for the disease using a new unobtrusive testing procedure.

“It’s a very simple test and requires very little on the part of each individual citizen,” Pelosi said at a conference announcing the initiative. “All you have to do is send a stool sample to my office in Washington.

Honorable Nancy Pelosi
1236 Longworth H.O.B.
Washington, DC 20515
Just put a 14” unbroken log in an Adidas Cloudform sneaker box.

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Old 03-28-2020, 06:21 PM   #650
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O_P_T View Post
I couldn't get past the paywall, but there is an article here that quotes some of the Op-Ed.
That’s most of it.

Thanks OPT
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Old 03-28-2020, 09:30 PM   #651
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patswin View Post
The number of deaths is rising. The death rate as a percentage of cases is not. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

I'll cite just US stats from worldometers because the world total includes China and everyone knows they lie.

1.6% death rate. It will fall further.

Just looking at Massachusetts, and testing stats.
https://www.mass.gov/doc/covid-19-ca...-2020/download

35000+ tested, 4200+ positive.
Could this suggest the load on the health care system is partly due to people scared to death and heading to the doctor office / ER? It's at least possible.

The total number of people hospitalized in MA today is 350. Three hundred fifty. So all the rest of those positives are recovering at home. And be sure they won't be in the death stats.
According to China, they're in the clear (Which I don't believe) but the world rate is up to 4.6% but let's do look at the US (And this is the site I've been using, also). There were over 19,400 new cases just yesterday. One day. There were 1,200 deaths.

I totally think more people are going to the Hospital for any little thing, now that paranoia is spreading

---------- Post added at 09:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:26 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight Schrute View Post
Not true.

Read the link.
I have the paywall issue, too but I get the gist and yes, I agree this is overblown. Millions are not going to die, ffs

---------- Post added at 09:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:28 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by O_P_T View Post
You keep saying that, why?

Why isn't it correct to compare this to the flu?
Why not compare it to Aids?? Or heart disease? Or pneumonia. How many older people die of that each year? Or drug overdoses? Why the flu? Why don't we compare the flu to those other things?
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Old 03-28-2020, 09:52 PM   #652
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The hospital my wife works at is usually busy. Right now they have very few non covid patients. Her unit has been converted to covid patients. The other unit on her floor is going to be overflow. The patients on her floor are non icu need patients. Another unit is shut down due to lack of patients. Another has very few. My wife has been told by her heart doctor no to those patients. Tonight she is in prison, well the prison unit (for the federal pen that is her).
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Old 03-28-2020, 10:22 PM   #653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
According to China, they're in the clear (Which I don't believe) but the world rate is up to 4.6% but let's do look at the US (And this is the site I've been using, also). There were over 19,400 new cases just yesterday. One day. There were 1,200 deaths.

I totally think more people are going to the Hospital for any little thing, now that paranoia is spreading

---------- Post added at 09:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:26 PM ----------



I have the paywall issue, too but I get the gist and yes, I agree this is overblown. Millions are not going to die, ffs

---------- Post added at 09:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:28 PM ----------



Why not compare it to Aids?? Or heart disease? Or pneumonia. How many older people die of that each year? Or drug overdoses? Why the flu? Why don't we compare the flu to those other things?

Because quite simply the flu is a virus that hits every single year and wipes out 30K-60K. It’s by far the most comparable for anyone that can think logically.

And there’s no halt of the economy. No relief. No second thoughts.
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Old 03-28-2020, 11:16 PM   #654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight Schrute View Post
Because quite simply the flu is a virus that hits every single year and wipes out 30K-60K. It’s by far the most comparable for anyone that can think logically.

And there’s no halt of the economy. No relief. No second thoughts.
Well because the media doesn't treat the flu like it's the Walking Dead coming
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Old 03-29-2020, 07:14 AM   #655
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Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
Well because the media doesn't treat the flu like it's the Walking Dead coming
That’s my point
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Old 03-29-2020, 08:08 AM   #656
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Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
Well because the media doesn't treat the flu like it's the Walking Dead coming
Yes. It doesn't appear that the media has realized they could blame the Flu on Trump as well.
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Old 03-29-2020, 09:16 AM   #657
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Originally Posted by BostonTim View Post
Yes. It doesn't appear that the media has realized they could blame the Flu on Trump as well.
Well I will blame what's happening on him since he sent 18 tons of PPE to China in February when everyone knew this was coming to the US

The United States Announces Assistance To Combat the Novel Coronavirus

This week the State Department has facilitated the transportation of nearly 17.8 tons of donated medical supplies to the Chinese people, including masks, gowns, gauze, respirators, and other vital materials. These donations are a testament to the generosity of the American people.

Today, the United States government is announcing it is prepared to spend up to $100 million in existing funds to assist China and other impacted countries, both directly and through multilateral organizations, to contain and combat the novel coronavirus.
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Old 03-29-2020, 01:03 PM   #658
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Originally Posted by HipKat View Post
Well I will blame what's happening on him since he sent 18 tons of PPE to China in February when everyone knew this was coming to the US

The United States Announces Assistance To Combat the Novel Coronavirus

This week the State Department has facilitated the transportation of nearly 17.8 tons of donated medical supplies to the Chinese people, including masks, gowns, gauze, respirators, and other vital materials. These donations are a testament to the generosity of the American people.

Today, the United States government is announcing it is prepared to spend up to $100 million in existing funds to assist China and other impacted countries, both directly and through multilateral organizations, to contain and combat the novel coronavirus.
You’re in for a long 4 and 1/2 years. Minimum.
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Old 03-29-2020, 02:44 PM   #659
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Someone posted online this thought (and it’s probably true):

The Coronavirus has actually LOWERED the death rate of Chicago.


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Old 03-29-2020, 02:53 PM   #660
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Originally Posted by PatsFan09 View Post
Someone posted online this thought (and it’s probably true):

The Coronavirus has actually LOWERED the death rate of Chicago.


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lol.. but sad at the same time

---------- Post added at 02:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:51 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight Schrute View Post
You’re in for a long 4 and 1/2 years. Minimum.
Minimum? You, like most people brainwashed by Trump, have issues dude. Seriously
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