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Old 03-30-2018, 04:00 PM   #1126
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Originally Posted by anderson View Post
Holy shit, we might just have hit orbital thermal nuke style hot takes when it's a recurring theme that Nick Cruz is a martyr who was bullied by all the cool anti gun kids at school....

Ah, do we know that she bullied him, or is it just that he was bullied?
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Old 03-30-2018, 04:07 PM   #1127
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Originally Posted by BostonBlackie View Post
Ah, do we know that she bullied him, or is it just that he was bullied?
I don't even know if he was bullied at all.

Nor do I suspect that the assholes tweeting do either. Not that assholes care about those kinds of things.
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Old 03-30-2018, 04:09 PM   #1128
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Originally Posted by Jaric View Post
I don't even know if he was bullied at all.

Nor do I suspect that the assholes tweeting do either. Not that assholes care about those kinds of things.

No, just throw something at someone.
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Old 03-30-2018, 04:21 PM   #1129
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Originally Posted by BostonBlackie View Post
No, just throw something at someone.
Yep. Shitty people living shitty lives shitting on everything.

You ever notice how really successful happy people rarely get involved in this kind of asshattery?
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Old 03-30-2018, 04:45 PM   #1130
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Originally Posted by Jaric View Post
I don't even know if he was bullied at all.

Nor do I suspect that the assholes tweeting do either. Not that assholes care about those kinds of things.
I have no idea if any of these kids did but....someone was. And I most certainly find the tweet horrible.

As I said in the prior post it's not an excuse but it is relevant as 70% of school shooters were. A vast majority of teenage suicides involve a volunerable child who was bullied. You can all say not the children I interact with but it holds true for the I children interact with.

Quote:
To Cruz, the campus’ sun-splashed courtyards were a dark place where he was mocked and ridiculed for his odd behavior, according to interviews with close family friends, students and recently released police and mental health reports.

Someone could have approached a faculty member, a guidance counselor, a teacher and said, ‘This kid gets bullied a lot, someone should do something,’ ” said student Manolo Alvarez, 17, who had history class with Cruz. “I regret definitely not saying anything.”
Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/loca...#storylink=cpy

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Old 03-30-2018, 04:56 PM   #1131
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I remember the stories coming out early on that he was bullied...I think it was actually the students who said that.

What does it matter? Getting bullied it not an excuse for murder. Fvck him.
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Who is this self-important instigating douche-bag, anyway?
Dude, Baron has been a valued member of this forum for quite some time.
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Old 03-30-2018, 05:33 PM   #1132
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Originally Posted by mikiemo83 View Post
supervised sports.



my point Is the day is so full for these kids real friendships are not as easily built. Softball with X but hurry to dance with Y but the whole time there are adults over seeing the whole thing.



Kids are missing out on learning how to just exist without a lesson or commitment, to keep themselves busy for the day.



That is what I believe Baron did, and I had to as my single mom went back to college.


Eh, I donít agree. Perhaps for some kids. I live in a neighborhood where all of the kids from 3 years to 12 years old all spend time outside playing , running around, hanging out in different peoplesí houses, etc.

Iím not saying that those things donít happen in some places, but itís grossly over exaggerated .

Now, that doesnít change the fact that I wouldnít mind cell phones being banned in school. That would promote more socializing , etc.


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Old 03-30-2018, 06:01 PM   #1133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron Samedi View Post
I remember the stories coming out early on that he was bullied...I think it was actually the students who said that.

What does it matter? Getting bullied it not an excuse for murder. Fvck him.
No it's not an excuse at all, but it is a part of the profile "loner" , and it is a problem with teen suicide. It should be discussed not as a defense but as a possible deterrent, for suicide and and maybe just accepting more kids who are different in a variety of ways. Kids are getting better but some are still just plan mean.

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Old 03-30-2018, 06:27 PM   #1134
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Originally Posted by deec77 View Post
While it's certainly not an excuse, nor do I know who/if he was bullied by any of the anti gun kids. It is a fair question, 70% of school shooters were bulllied.





Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/news/loca...#storylink=cpy

It wouldn't shock me if he turned into a bully himself.

More teen suicides are also now attributed in some way to cyberbullying than ever before.

https://www.cdc.gov/violencepreventi...on-final-a.pdf

So while I certainly don't approve of the Tweet and its certainly not helpful. I see no reason not to speak about bullying and the effects it has on some vulnerable children.

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That tweet was not sent to highlight bullying.

That doesn't mean I don't want focus on bullying
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Old 03-30-2018, 07:03 PM   #1135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anderson View Post
That tweet was not sent to highlight bullying.

That doesn't mean I don't want focus on bullying
Your right, it came from a small clip of her speech. Where she spoke about his mental health problems.

I never said you didn't want to discuss it just that it's important.

I'm not saying she's wrong, and I really hate remarks taken out of context.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/di...chool-shooter/

Snopes
Quote:
But placed in context, GonzŠlez’s remarks reveal that students at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School had alerted officials over concerns about Cruz’s potentially dangerous behavior and had not ostracized merely out of spite:
They didn't ostracized him out of spite but they did ostracize him. Again no excuse for his actions but this is the pretext for the bullying remarks.

"This isn't just a mental health issue ". No one is saying it is, but, she's right perhaps he wouldn't have killed as many with a knife. Perhaps if he got the help they all concede he needed he wouldn't have shot anyone, just a thought too.



I have nothing against these children speaking their minds about gun control have at it.

Blame the adults not the kids.

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Old 03-30-2018, 08:30 PM   #1136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron Samedi View Post
I remember the stories coming out early on that he was bullied...I think it was actually the students who said that.

What does it matter? Getting bullied it not an excuse for murder. Fvck him.
It matters if the intent is to understand what drives the behavior so you can try and create environments that don't encourage it. At least as much as one is able to do so reasonably.
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Old 03-30-2018, 09:10 PM   #1137
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I see. Well, good luck with that, trying to end kids bullying each other.

I agree with the sentiment, but the idea that you can regulate it out of existence is not a serious or realistic one.
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Who is this self-important instigating douche-bag, anyway?
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Old 03-31-2018, 08:15 AM   #1138
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Originally Posted by Baron Samedi View Post
I see. Well, good luck with that, trying to end kids bullying each other.

I agree with the sentiment, but the idea that you can regulate it out of existence is not a serious or realistic one.
Who said anything about regulating out of exsistsnce?

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Old 03-31-2018, 08:40 AM   #1139
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Yeah, it's almost like religion influences behavior.
Or...we have manufactured religion to justify our behavior. Jesus is a get out of jail free card fer cryin out loud.

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Old 04-01-2018, 10:16 AM   #1140
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OP-ED CONTRIBUTOR

I Tried to Befriend Nikolas Cruz. He Still Killed My Friends.
By Isabelle Robinson
March 27, 2018

PARKLAND, Fla. — My first interaction with Nikolas Cruz happened when I was in seventh grade. I was eating lunch with my friends, most likely discussing One Direction or Ed Sheeran, when I felt a sudden pain in my lower back. The force of the blow knocked the wind out of my 90-pound body; tears stung my eyes. I turned around and saw him, smirking. I had never seen this boy before, but I would never forget his face. His eyes were lit up with a sick, twisted joy as he watched me cry.

The apple that he had thrown at my back rolled slowly along the tiled floor. A cafeteria aide rushed over to ask me if I was O.K. I don’t remember if Mr. Cruz was confronted over his actions, but in my 12-year-old naÔvetť, I trusted that the adults around me would take care of the situation.

Five years later, hiding in a dark closet inside Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, I would discover just how wrong I was.

I am not writing this piece to malign Nikolas Cruz any more than he already has been. I have faith that history will condemn him for his crimes. I am writing this because of the disturbing number of comments I’ve read that go something like this: Maybe if Mr. Cruz’s classmates and peers had been a little nicer to him, the shooting at Stoneman Douglas would never have occurred.

This deeply dangerous sentiment, expressed under the #WalkUpNotOut hashtag, implies that acts of school violence can be prevented if students befriend disturbed and potentially dangerous classmates. The idea that we are to blame, even implicitly, for the murders of our friends and teachers is a slap in the face to all Stoneman Douglas victims and survivors.

A year after I was assaulted by Mr. Cruz, I was assigned to tutor him through my school’s peer counseling program. Being a peer counselor was the first real responsibility I had ever had, my first glimpse of adulthood, and I took it very seriously.

Despite my discomfort, I sat down with him, alone. I was forced to endure his cursing me out and ogling my chest until the hourlong session ended. When I was done, I felt a surge of pride for having organized his binder and helped him with his homework.........

............................


No amount of kindness or compassion alone would have changed the person that Nikolas Cruz is and was, or the horrendous actions he perpetrated. That is a weak excuse for the failures of our school system, our government and our gun laws.

..........


...................

Isabelle Robinson is a senior at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School.

Follow The New York Times Opinion section on Facebook and Twitter (@NYTopinion), and sign up for the Opinion Today newsletter.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/27/o...820180401&te=1
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