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Old 11-13-2017, 06:59 AM   #1
Mazz22
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Elway BROKE Denver

It is official. Elway has broken Denver. Hard to believe that just 2 years later that same defense that carried the corpse of Manning to a title, looks like a cream puff now. You could see it in Miller's eyes - fear - all game. He knew they had nothing to compete with the Pats even with Brady down Hogan and Cannon. That was as complete an undressing as I have ever witnessed at Mile High. Even Tebow managed to keep it close for a half back in '11.

This ALL rolls up to Elway. Why he brought in Vance Joseph and kicked Wade Phillips to the curb is its own private mystery but we saw the results last night. One of the most delicious wins in Pats history.

Last edited by Mazz22; 11-13-2017 at 07:09 AM..
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Old 11-13-2017, 07:02 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Mazz22 View Post
It is official. Elway has broken Denver. Hard to believe that just 2 years later that same defense that carried the corpse of Manning to a title, looks like a cream puff now. You could see it in Miller's eyes - fear - all game. He knew they had nothing to compete with the Pats even with Brady down Hogan and Cannon. That was as complete an undressing as I have witnessed at Mile High. Even Tebow managed to keep it close for a half back in '11.

This ALL rolls up to Elway. Why he brought in Vance Joseph and kicked Wade Phillips to the curb is its own private mystery but we saw the results last night. One of the most delicious wins in Pats history.
He sees what Jerrah has in Dallas with Jason Garrett and wants the same thing for himself.
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Old 11-13-2017, 07:08 AM   #3
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Not 1 Pro Bowl caliber player drafted since he took over.

In fact, other than 3 bad QBs, name any player he drafted who is still with the team.

You're right. That's too hard - just name any player he drafted.
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Old 11-13-2017, 07:13 AM   #4
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The Broncos were so impressed they gave Elway 5 more years to complete the demolition.
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Old 11-13-2017, 08:16 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by chevss454 View Post
Not 1 Pro Bowl caliber player drafted since he took over.

In fact, other than 3 bad QBs, name any player he drafted who is still with the team.

You're right. That's too hard - just name any player he drafted.
players drafted since elway was named vp of football operations in jan of 2011


2017

1 1 20 20 Garett Bolles T Utah
2 2 19 51 DeMarcus Walker DE Florida State
3 3 18 82 Carlos Henderson WR Louisiana Tech
4 3 37 101 Brendan Langley DB Lamar
5 5 1 145 Jake Butt TE Michigan
6 5 29 172 Isaiah McKenzie WR Georgia
7 6 19 203 De'Angelo Henderson RB Coastal Carolina
8 7 35 253 Chad Kelly QB Mississippi

2016

1 1 26 26 Paxton Lynch QB Memphis
2 2 32 63 Adam Gotsis DT Georgia Tech
3 3 36 98 Justin Simmons DB Boston College
4 4 38 136 Devontae Booker RB Utah
5 5 5 144 Connor McGovern G Missouri
6 6 1 176 Andy Janovich RB Nebraska
7 6 44 219 Will Parks DB Arizona
8 7 7 228 Riley Dixon P Syracuse

2015

1 1 23 23 Shane Ray DE Missouri
2 2 27 59 Ty Sambrailo T Colorado State
3 3 28 92 Jeff Heuerman TE Ohio State
4 4 34 133 Max Garcia C Florida
5 5 28 164 Lorenzo Doss DB Tulane
6 6 27 203 Darius Kilgo DT Maryland
7 7 33 250 Trevor Siemian QB Northwestern
8 7 34 251 Taurean Nixon DB Tulane
9 7 35 252 Josh Furman DB Oklahoma State

2014

1 1 31 31 Bradley Roby DB Ohio State
2 2 24 56 Cody Latimer WR Indiana
3 3 31 95 Michael Schofield T Michigan
4 5 16 156 Lamin Barrow LB Louisiana State
5 6 31 207 Matt Paradis C Boise State
6 7 27 242 Corey Nelson LB Oklahoma

2013

1 1 28 28 Sylvester Williams DT North Carolina
2 2 26 58 Montee Ball RB Wisconsin
3 3 28 90 Kayvon Webster DB South Florida
4 5 13 146 Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky
5 5 28 161 Tavarres King WR Georgia
6 6 5 173 Vinston Painter T Virginia Tech
7 7 28 234 Zac Dysert QB Miami (OH)

2012

1 2 4 36 Derek Wolfe DT Cincinnati
2 2 25 57 Brock Osweiler QB Arizona State
3 3 4 67 Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State
4 4 6 101 Omar Bolden DB Arizona State
5 4 13 108 Philip Blake C Baylor
6 5 2 137 Malik Jackson DT Tennessee
7 6 18 188 Danny Trevathan LB Kentucky

2011

1 1 2 2 Von Miller LB Texas A&M
2 2 13 45 Rahim Moore DB UCLA
3 2 14 46 Orlando Franklin T Miami (FL)
4 3 3 67 Nate Irving LB North Carolina State
5 4 11 108 Quinton Carter DB Oklahoma
6 4 32 129 Julius Thomas TE Portland State
7 6 24 189 Mike Mohamed LB California
8 7 1 204 Virgil Green TE Nevada
9 7 44 247 Jeremy Beal DE Oklahoma
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Old 11-13-2017, 08:23 AM   #6
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Elway doesn't get credit for 2011.
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Old 11-13-2017, 08:26 AM   #7
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Elway doesn't get credit for 2011.
so BB dosen't get credit for the 2000 patriots draft? LOL
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Old 11-13-2017, 02:31 PM   #8
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players drafted since elway was named vp of football operations in jan of 2011


2017

1 1 20 20 Garett Bolles T Utah
2 2 19 51 DeMarcus Walker DE Florida State
3 3 18 82 Carlos Henderson WR Louisiana Tech
4 3 37 101 Brendan Langley DB Lamar
5 5 1 145 Jake Butt TE Michigan
6 5 29 172 Isaiah McKenzie WR Georgia
7 6 19 203 De'Angelo Henderson RB Coastal Carolina
8 7 35 253 Chad Kelly QB Mississippi

2016

1 1 26 26 Paxton Lynch QB Memphis
2 2 32 63 Adam Gotsis DT Georgia Tech
3 3 36 98 Justin Simmons DB Boston College
4 4 38 136 Devontae Booker RB Utah
5 5 5 144 Connor McGovern G Missouri
6 6 1 176 Andy Janovich RB Nebraska
7 6 44 219 Will Parks DB Arizona
8 7 7 228 Riley Dixon P Syracuse

2015

1 1 23 23 Shane Ray DE Missouri
2 2 27 59 Ty Sambrailo T Colorado State
3 3 28 92 Jeff Heuerman TE Ohio State
4 4 34 133 Max Garcia C Florida
5 5 28 164 Lorenzo Doss DB Tulane
6 6 27 203 Darius Kilgo DT Maryland
7 7 33 250 Trevor Siemian QB Northwestern
8 7 34 251 Taurean Nixon DB Tulane
9 7 35 252 Josh Furman DB Oklahoma State

2014

1 1 31 31 Bradley Roby DB Ohio State
2 2 24 56 Cody Latimer WR Indiana
3 3 31 95 Michael Schofield T Michigan
4 5 16 156 Lamin Barrow LB Louisiana State
5 6 31 207 Matt Paradis C Boise State
6 7 27 242 Corey Nelson LB Oklahoma

2013

1 1 28 28 Sylvester Williams DT North Carolina
2 2 26 58 Montee Ball RB Wisconsin
3 3 28 90 Kayvon Webster DB South Florida
4 5 13 146 Quanterus Smith DE Western Kentucky
5 5 28 161 Tavarres King WR Georgia
6 6 5 173 Vinston Painter T Virginia Tech
7 7 28 234 Zac Dysert QB Miami (OH)

2012

1 2 4 36 Derek Wolfe DT Cincinnati
2 2 25 57 Brock Osweiler QB Arizona State
3 3 4 67 Ronnie Hillman RB San Diego State
4 4 6 101 Omar Bolden DB Arizona State
5 4 13 108 Philip Blake C Baylor
6 5 2 137 Malik Jackson DT Tennessee
7 6 18 188 Danny Trevathan LB Kentucky

2011

1 1 2 2 Von Miller LB Texas A&M
2 2 13 45 Rahim Moore DB UCLA
3 2 14 46 Orlando Franklin T Miami (FL)
4 3 3 67 Nate Irving LB North Carolina State
5 4 11 108 Quinton Carter DB Oklahoma
6 4 32 129 Julius Thomas TE Portland State
7 6 24 189 Mike Mohamed LB California
8 7 1 204 Virgil Green TE Nevada
9 7 44 247 Jeremy Beal DE Oklahoma
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Old 11-13-2017, 07:06 AM   #9
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Then there is this.

Benjamin Allbright ✔@AllbrightNFL
This #Broncos disaster is exacerbated by the thought that they could have had Kyle Shanahan and Wade Phillips if they hadn't gone cheap.
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Old Today, 08:05 AM   #10
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Pretty good historical take on the AFC and on Denver and how far they have fallen mostly due to Elway's poor drafting the last few years and inability to find a QB post-Manning. Elway also recently called the team "soft" after they lost to the Pats and that has not sat well with some of his players (see Harris quote below).


The Debrief, Week 11: Major revelations as 2017 season unfolds

By Gregg Rosenthal
Around The NFL Editor

The great AFC rivals to Bill Belichick's New England Patriots over the years have fallen by the wayside, one by one, from Bill Cowher's Steelers to Peyton Manning's Colts to Rex Ryan's Jets and the Ed Reed Ravens. The John Elway-built Broncos felt different because of two wins over New England in the AFC Championship Game and because of the man in charge. But this 2017 season has revealed how fallible Elway looks as a general manager without Peyton Manning at quarterback.

Monday's firing of offensive coordinator Mike McCoy, days after Elway called the team "soft" at a team event, is the type of sequence that is only supposed to happen to other organizations, not one that won at least 12 games every season from 2012 to '15.

Elway's fingerprints are all over Denver's 3-7 record. His personnel choices on the offensive line, where he has invested plenty of money and draft picks, have held the organization back over the last three seasons. (Elway knew the line that won the Super Bowl after the 2015 season needed a total overhaul, and it has remained one of the league's worst units ever since.) The health-related retirement of former coach Gary Kubiak was tough luck for everyone involved, but Broncos coach Vance Joseph was Elway's hand-picked successor, and McCoy was a familiar face, having worked as a Broncos coordinator earlier in Elway's front-office tenure. The team showed no interest in retaining former defensive coordinator Wade Phillips, who has quickly turned around the Rams while the Broncos' defense took a step back.

More than anything, Elway's drafts have allowed the organization to turn soft. There isn't enough homegrown talent to mix in with Elway's excellent free-agent pickups. After many hits in his first draft classes, his best draft picks over the last five years are probably center Matt Paradis, cornerback Bradley Roby and safety Justin Simmons, three solid contributors who aren't exactly superstars. Only two rookies from the team's entire 2017 class were even active for Sunday's loss to the Bengals (first-round pick Garett Bolles and corner Brendan Langley). Elway's best offensive draft pick from the last three years, for lack of any other options, is probably 2015 seventh-round quarterback Trevor Siemian, who was also inactive Sunday. The last Pro Bowler Elway drafted was Von Miller in 2011.

Elway's recruiting skills bringing Peyton Manning to town as a free agent in 2012 should not be underestimated, but otherwise, the quarterback position has vexed the organization. Brock Osweiler, a second-round pick of Elway's in 2012, turned down the Broncos' big offer as a free agent in 2016 after the team's Super Bowl win, only to return 18 months, one trade and one release later, curiously chosen as a better option the last three weeks over Siemian and the team's 2016 first-round pick, Paxton Lynch.

Known as one of the most competitive guys ever to play the sport or run a franchise, Elway is too integral to the entire organization not to have his hands in all aspects of the team. NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport foreshadowed McCoy's firing referring to Elway's frustrations with the offense, which were apparent in his comments about the team getting soft. Not every player took them kindly.

"Everybody in this organization is accountable for how we're playing right now. Ain't nothing soft in my bones," cornerback Chris Harris told ESPN's Jeff Legwold after the team's loss to Cincinnati.

That accountability starts at the top.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...season-unfolds
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"No order except for Tom being the best. He does things those other guys [Manning, Brees] can't do. His pocket presence is better, he throws a better ball than those guys. He's a winner better than all those guys."
- Aaron Rodgers

"Brady is the greatest of all time ... the consistency, every single year he does it. And he doesn't have, all time, the greatest players around him." - Jim Kelly
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Old Today, 09:08 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazz22 View Post
Pretty good historical take on the AFC and on Denver and how far they have fallen mostly due to Elway's poor drafting the last few years and inability to find a QB post-Manning. Elway also recently called the team "soft" after they lost to the Pats and that has not sat well with some of his players (see Harris quote below).


The Debrief, Week 11: Major revelations as 2017 season unfolds

By Gregg Rosenthal
Around The NFL Editor

The great AFC rivals to Bill Belichick's New England Patriots over the years have fallen by the wayside, one by one, from Bill Cowher's Steelers to Peyton Manning's Colts to Rex Ryan's Jets and the Ed Reed Ravens. The John Elway-built Broncos felt different because of two wins over New England in the AFC Championship Game and because of the man in charge. But this 2017 season has revealed how fallible Elway looks as a general manager without Peyton Manning at quarterback.

Monday's firing of offensive coordinator Mike McCoy, days after Elway called the team "soft" at a team event, is the type of sequence that is only supposed to happen to other organizations, not one that won at least 12 games every season from 2012 to '15.

Elway's fingerprints are all over Denver's 3-7 record. His personnel choices on the offensive line, where he has invested plenty of money and draft picks, have held the organization back over the last three seasons. (Elway knew the line that won the Super Bowl after the 2015 season needed a total overhaul, and it has remained one of the league's worst units ever since.) The health-related retirement of former coach Gary Kubiak was tough luck for everyone involved, but Broncos coach Vance Joseph was Elway's hand-picked successor, and McCoy was a familiar face, having worked as a Broncos coordinator earlier in Elway's front-office tenure. The team showed no interest in retaining former defensive coordinator Wade Phillips, who has quickly turned around the Rams while the Broncos' defense took a step back.

More than anything, Elway's drafts have allowed the organization to turn soft. There isn't enough homegrown talent to mix in with Elway's excellent free-agent pickups. After many hits in his first draft classes, his best draft picks over the last five years are probably center Matt Paradis, cornerback Bradley Roby and safety Justin Simmons, three solid contributors who aren't exactly superstars. Only two rookies from the team's entire 2017 class were even active for Sunday's loss to the Bengals (first-round pick Garett Bolles and corner Brendan Langley). Elway's best offensive draft pick from the last three years, for lack of any other options, is probably 2015 seventh-round quarterback Trevor Siemian, who was also inactive Sunday. The last Pro Bowler Elway drafted was Von Miller in 2011.

Elway's recruiting skills bringing Peyton Manning to town as a free agent in 2012 should not be underestimated, but otherwise, the quarterback position has vexed the organization. Brock Osweiler, a second-round pick of Elway's in 2012, turned down the Broncos' big offer as a free agent in 2016 after the team's Super Bowl win, only to return 18 months, one trade and one release later, curiously chosen as a better option the last three weeks over Siemian and the team's 2016 first-round pick, Paxton Lynch.

Known as one of the most competitive guys ever to play the sport or run a franchise, Elway is too integral to the entire organization not to have his hands in all aspects of the team. NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport foreshadowed McCoy's firing referring to Elway's frustrations with the offense, which were apparent in his comments about the team getting soft. Not every player took them kindly.

"Everybody in this organization is accountable for how we're playing right now. Ain't nothing soft in my bones," cornerback Chris Harris told ESPN's Jeff Legwold after the team's loss to Cincinnati.

That accountability starts at the top.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap300...season-unfolds
good article, but I have one nitpicky point of contention-

a rival is somebody who competes with you with the ability to win the same ultimate prize as you. That kind of excludes the JETE on parliamentary procedure if nothing else.
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Old Today, 09:12 AM   #12
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good article, but I have one nitpicky point of contention-

a rival is somebody who competes with you with the ability to win the same ultimate prize as you. That kind of excludes the JETE on parliamentary procedure if nothing else.
Yeah. Putting Ryan in there was a bit of a stretch for sure.
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Old Today, 08:25 AM   #13
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It was the Denver D that brought them to 2 SBs with one win. To give Elway credit for bringing in Manning might be a bit of an overstatement.
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Old Today, 09:18 AM   #14
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Lest anyone forget, it was Ryan that knocked out the wagon Pats team in a Division round and went to back to back AFC Championships.

They were trouble for a brief period.
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