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Old 05-10-2020, 03:05 PM   #1
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Viewing alert - Super Bowl 36 on Fox Sports right now.

Watch it and enjoy your clams, cocksuckers.

https://youtu.be/5vaad79Aoic
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Old 05-10-2020, 03:24 PM   #2
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McCleon was Brady’s first Super Bowl victim. He would not be the last.
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Old 05-10-2020, 04:53 PM   #3
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Old 05-10-2020, 05:02 PM   #4
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Tuned in just in time for the final drive. The thrill never goes away.
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Old 05-10-2020, 09:49 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KontradictioN View Post
McCleon was Bradyís first Super Bowl victim. He would not be the last.
How was that not a penalty for a shot to the head? Lucky Edelman wasnt knocked out, or maybe he was and didnt tell anyone. lol
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Old 05-11-2020, 05:51 AM   #6
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Great game plan by BB led to a great game from a Pats' fan's perspective. I watched it in the entirety yesterday with an eye to compare that Pats team to this one. BB's strategy was so obvious looking at it almost 20 years later. Tough defense and adequate, game-managed offense with conservative play calling til the very end. That D played so aggressively they were totally gassed at the end of the 3rd quarter. Without the 3 turnovers (2 ints/1 fumble recovery) the Pats wouldn't have won. That team was totally driven by the defense. It kept St. Louis from getting rhythm and gaining momentum until gassed in the 4th quarter.

I don't want to start up a firestorm here but I didn't see a single pass that 2002 Brady threw that 2020 Stidham can't also throw & I didn't see a single situation that Brady was in that Stidham couldn't handle as well. (I'm not judging Stidham based on a few college highlights and 1 preseason with the Pats; I watched every game he played at Auburn for 2 years.) (I'm also not comparing Stidham now to what Brady eventually became.)

Check out the stats of the game here:
https://www.pro-football-reference.c...0202030nwe.htm

Pats offense: 25 runs, 27 passes. Brady went 16-27-145 yds; those are game manager stats. I don't see any way in hell BB tanks this year with that game tattooed in his memory. That strategy can still work today with a few modifications to account for the changes in the way games are played now.


That game may have been the game that gave birth to BB's "bend but don't break" strategy.
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Old 05-11-2020, 09:58 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by chevss454 View Post
Great game plan by BB led to a great game from a Pats' fan's perspective. I watched it in the entirety yesterday with an eye to compare that Pats team to this one. BB's strategy was so obvious looking at it almost 20 years later. Tough defense and adequate, game-managed offense with conservative play calling til the very end. That D played so aggressively they were totally gassed at the end of the 3rd quarter. Without the 3 turnovers (2 ints/1 fumble recovery) the Pats wouldn't have won. That team was totally driven by the defense. It kept St. Louis from getting rhythm and gaining momentum until gassed in the 4th quarter.

I don't want to start up a firestorm here but I didn't see a single pass that 2002 Brady threw that 2020 Stidham can't also throw & I didn't see a single situation that Brady was in that Stidham couldn't handle as well. (I'm not judging Stidham based on a few college highlights and 1 preseason with the Pats; I watched every game he played at Auburn for 2 years.) (I'm also not comparing Stidham now to what Brady eventually became.)

Check out the stats of the game here:
https://www.pro-football-reference.c...0202030nwe.htm

Pats offense: 25 runs, 27 passes. Brady went 16-27-145 yds; those are game manager stats. I don't see any way in hell BB tanks this year with that game tattooed in his memory. That strategy can still work today with a few modifications to account for the changes in the way games are played now.


That game may have been the game that gave birth to BB's "bend but don't break" strategy.
Any professional quarterback can make the throws that Brady can, and some maybe moreso. Itís the little things - the eye manipulation, the tedious breakdown of game film to where he picks up on little tendencies he can exploit, knowing when to bail out of a play instead of trying to throw through defenders, the pocket presence, etc. Thatís what we donít know about Stidham. How many of those throws that went into the dirt last year when nobody was open would have went the other way with Stidham behind center?
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Old 05-11-2020, 02:36 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KontradictioN View Post
Any professional quarterback can make the throws that Brady can, and some maybe moreso. Itís the little things - the eye manipulation, the tedious breakdown of game film to where he picks up on little tendencies he can exploit, knowing when to bail out of a play instead of trying to throw through defenders, the pocket presence, etc. Thatís what we donít know about Stidham. How many of those throws that went into the dirt last year when nobody was open would have went the other way with Stidham behind center?



I purposely said I was comparing 2002 Brady with 2020 Stidham & not 2019 Brady to Stidham. All those nuances of the position you brought up didn't apply to 2002 Brady. Those came later.
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Old 05-11-2020, 03:10 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by chevss454 View Post
I purposely said I was comparing 2002 Brady with 2020 Stidham & not 2019 Brady to Stidham. All those nuances of the position you brought up didn't apply to 2002 Brady. Those came later.
What do you call that pump fake and freezing McCleon at the goal line, then? Thatís a perfect example of tedious film review. There were also stories in the 2001 season of Brady growing by leaps and bounds re: eye movement in the pocket. Reference Milloyís quote in Americaís Game for more examples on that if you wish. He wasnít the Brady we all know yet, but he wasnít Mitch Trubisky either.
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Old 05-12-2020, 12:18 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by chevss454 View Post
I purposely said I was comparing 2002 Brady with 2020 Stidham & not 2019 Brady to Stidham. All those nuances of the position you brought up didn't apply to 2002 Brady. Those came later.
You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady. There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont, very seldom, not to mention passing was a whole lot different back then than it is now and you know that. This is not 2001, its a different game now. Its harder to win that way now and it was harder to win that way then with any ol guy. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do.

In fact, its probably best to stop comparing Stidham to Brady at all, because its not fair, and I know thats what people will do, but if you do that, you are setting yourself up for a bad time. Chances are very good, he will not be Brady, chances are good we might not ever see that again. Let him be Stidham and we will see what happens. He has to put in the work, he has to do the things. Its not, oh man did you see that pass in preseason, he is going to be great. I imagine the pats are going to try to ball control and playaction and hope our D can hold up.

Last edited by Patriots71; 05-12-2020 at 12:22 AM..
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Old 05-12-2020, 09:00 AM   #11
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You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady. There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont, very seldom, not to mention passing was a whole lot different back then than it is now and you know that. This is not 2001, its a different game now. Its harder to win that way now and it was harder to win that way then with any ol guy. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do.

In fact, its probably best to stop comparing Stidham to Brady at all, because its not fair, and I know thats what people will do, but if you do that, you are setting yourself up for a bad time. Chances are very good, he will not be Brady, chances are good we might not ever see that again. Let him be Stidham and we will see what happens. He has to put in the work, he has to do the things. Its not, oh man did you see that pass in preseason, he is going to be great. I imagine the pats are going to try to ball control and playaction and hope our D can hold up.
Yeah, Iím amazed at the expectations for Stidham. As if the expectation is for BB to catch lightning in a bottle twice since history is not on Stidhamís side here as a fourth round pick. Iím not sure what people have seen of him to warrant some of these expectations. He was highly touted coming out of HS. I remember wanting Florida to recruit him. But he was largely a disappointment at that level and he took a beating. His lone professional pass was a pick-6 that forced the team to put Brady back in the game. So what have people seen to warrant this confidence? Preseason performance against off man and zone coverage? Not saying theyíll be wrong, I just donít see any way one can comment one way or the the other.
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Old 05-12-2020, 09:05 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KontradictioN View Post
What do you call that pump fake and freezing McCleon at the goal line, then? Thatís a perfect example of tedious film review. There were also stories in the 2001 season of Brady growing by leaps and bounds re: eye movement in the pocket. Reference Milloyís quote in Americaís Game for more examples on that if you wish. He wasnít the Brady we all know yet, but he wasnít Mitch Trubisky either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patriots71 View Post
You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady. There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont, very seldom, not to mention passing was a whole lot different back then than it is now and you know that. This is not 2001, its a different game now. Its harder to win that way now and it was harder to win that way then with any ol guy. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do.

In fact, its probably best to stop comparing Stidham to Brady at all, because its not fair, and I know thats what people will do, but if you do that, you are setting yourself up for a bad time. Chances are very good, he will not be Brady, chances are good we might not ever see that again. Let him be Stidham and we will see what happens. He has to put in the work, he has to do the things. Its not, oh man did you see that pass in preseason, he is going to be great. I imagine the pats are going to try to ball control and playaction and hope our D can hold up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chevss454
Great game plan by BB led to a great game from a Pats' fan's perspective. I watched it in the entirety yesterday with an eye to compare that Pats team to this one. BB's strategy was so obvious looking at it almost 20 years later. Tough defense and adequate, game-managed offense with conservative play calling til the very end. That D played so aggressively they were totally gassed at the end of the 3rd quarter. Without the 3 turnovers (2 ints/1 fumble recovery) the Pats wouldn't have won. That team was totally driven by the defense. It kept St. Louis from getting rhythm and gaining momentum until gassed in the 4th quarter.

I don't want to start up a firestorm here but I didn't see a single pass that 2002 Brady threw that 2020 Stidham can't also throw & I didn't see a single situation that Brady was in that Stidham couldn't handle as well. (I'm not judging Stidham based on a few college highlights and 1 preseason with the Pats; I watched every game he played at Auburn for 2 years.) (I'm also not comparing Stidham now to what Brady eventually became.)

Check out the stats of the game here:
https://www.pro-football-reference.c...0202030nwe.htm

Pats offense: 25 runs, 27 passes. Brady went 16-27-145 yds; those are game manager stats. I don't see any way in hell BB tanks this year with that game tattooed in his memory. That strategy can still work today with a few modifications to account for the changes in the way games are played now.

That game may have been the game that gave birth to BB's "bend but don't break" strategy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KontradictioN View Post
What do you call that pump fake and freezing McCleon at the goal line, then? Thatís a perfect example of tedious film review. There were also stories in the 2001 season of Brady growing by leaps and bounds re: eye movement in the pocket. Reference Milloyís quote in Americaís Game for more examples on that if you wish. He wasnít the Brady we all know yet, but he wasnít Mitch Trubisky either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patriots71 View Post
You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady. There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont, very seldom, not to mention passing was a whole lot different back then than it is now and you know that. This is not 2001, its a different game now. Its harder to win that way now and it was harder to win that way then with any ol guy. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do.

In fact, its probably best to stop comparing Stidham to Brady at all, because its not fair, and I know thats what people will do, but if you do that, you are setting yourself up for a bad time. Chances are very good, he will not be Brady, chances are good we might not ever see that again. Let him be Stidham and we will see what happens. He has to put in the work, he has to do the things. Its not, oh man did you see that pass in preseason, he is going to be great. I imagine the pats are going to try to ball control and playaction and hope our D can hold up.

It's obvious that all we have with Stidham is potential - I agree with that and have no issue at all with that take. Otoh, his potential is the reason the Patriots drafted him last year and it's also why they didn't draft a QB this year or bring in a veteran. Btw, Brady was all potential entering his 2nd year, no? The fact is, Stidham has something the Patriots' scouts and coaches really like about him. You should both accept that as fact. Having watched every game he played at Auburn, I have an inkling about what it is they like. But since you both think I'm dumb as a post, I'll rely on others to do my talking for me. If you have a beef about what these authors say about him, you can take it up with them.

https://nesn.com/2020/05/patriots-ma...t-quarterback/
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...erback-in-2020
https://theathletic.com/1657865/2020...jordan-palmer/


For K: I call that basic HS coaching. I suggest you watch this video produced by the Patriots that shows Stidham in action. Football begins at the 3:00 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoYUNiWJhVg
Or this recap of the 2017 Iron Bowl when Auburn upset #1 ranked Alabama.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELMYpo2oXtY


For Middy: "You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady."

You're incorrigible but ok, I'll respond to words I never said. No NFL games but I did watch every game he played for Auburn over 2 years. How many of those did you watch? Now show me where I said Stidham "will win superbowls like Brady"? You can't because I didn't.

"There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont,..."

You mean like Brady's passing stats for 16-27-145 yds & 1 TD or do you mean no one can hand off the ball 27 times to running backs the way Brady did? BB won that game with coaching, a fierce D that caused 3 turnovers and a managed O. What I said in my original post that got your panties in a wad is that Stidham, imo, can do the very same things Brady did in that game. He had potential but he was not TFB yet. No one knew 6 SBs were ahead of him.


"This is not 2001, its a different game now. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do."

Let me remind you the 2000 Rams were the high flying, highly explosive "greatest show on turf". The Pats had a great defense. 3 turnovers. And a great game plan by BB on D & on O. I'm free to have my opinions just as you are. Brady was unproven but BB had an idea that he could manage the game. I have an idea that Stidham can do that, so, yes, I can compare Brady then to Stidham now. I did NOT compare Stidham to what Brady became and has done in his career. Brady is the GOAT and nothing will change that. I sure as hell can hope Stidham does well and comes close, though, and you telling me I can't have that hope, based on his potential, is asinine.

Btw, I'll let you in on a little secret - I've been told by more than 1 person inside the Pats (not media) that Stidham played almost as well as Brady in practices during preseason and continued to improve in practices throughout the season.
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Old 05-12-2020, 02:04 PM   #13
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It's obvious that all we have with Stidham is potential - I agree with that and have no issue at all with that take.
Fair enough. Apologies if I misunderstood you. I'm just newly posting here on a full-time basis so I don't quite have a handle on you as a poster or fan just yet. For the hell of it, I went back and broke down some of his preseason film with a particular eye on his touchdown passes. All of them were either against off man or zone coverages. So take it with a grain of salt. I will say, however, that the touchdown pass to Patterson in the 4th quarter of the Tennessee game was a very nice back shoulder throw.

Quote:
For K: I call that basic HS coaching. I suggest you watch this video produced by the Patriots that shows Stidham in action. Football begins at the 3:00 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoYUNiWJhVg
Or this recap of the 2017 Iron Bowl when Auburn upset #1 ranked Alabama.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELMYpo2oXtY
That kind of meticulous film breakdown, where you can spot a tendency like that, is not merely basic HS-level coaching. That was merely an example of the amount of work Brady put in behind the scenes that made him the GOAT. Not every corner squats on the goal line or tries to cut those underneath routes. McCleon did. Brady picked up on that in the film room. Will Stidham have that kind of discipline? Who knows?
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Old 05-12-2020, 04:55 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by chevss454 View Post
It's obvious that all we have with Stidham is potential - I agree with that and have no issue at all with that take. Otoh, his potential is the reason the Patriots drafted him last year and it's also why they didn't draft a QB this year or bring in a veteran. Btw, Brady was all potential entering his 2nd year, no? The fact is, Stidham has something the Patriots' scouts and coaches really like about him. You should both accept that as fact. Having watched every game he played at Auburn, I have an inkling about what it is they like. But since you both think I'm dumb as a post, I'll rely on others to do my talking for me. If you have a beef about what these authors say about him, you can take it up with them.

https://nesn.com/2020/05/patriots-ma...t-quarterback/
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/...erback-in-2020
https://theathletic.com/1657865/2020...jordan-palmer/


For K: I call that basic HS coaching. I suggest you watch this video produced by the Patriots that shows Stidham in action. Football begins at the 3:00 mark.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yoYUNiWJhVg
Or this recap of the 2017 Iron Bowl when Auburn upset #1 ranked Alabama.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELMYpo2oXtY


For Middy: "You have not seen Stidham play a single NFL regular season game, how about he played a game and then we can talk about how he will win superbowls like Brady."

You're incorrigible but ok, I'll respond to words I never said. No NFL games but I did watch every game he played for Auburn over 2 years. How many of those did you watch? Now show me where I said Stidham "will win superbowls like Brady"? You can't because I didn't.

"There is something to a first year starter doing what Brady did in that game, because they dont,..."

You mean like Brady's passing stats for 16-27-145 yds & 1 TD or do you mean no one can hand off the ball 27 times to running backs the way Brady did? BB won that game with coaching, a fierce D that caused 3 turnovers and a managed O. What I said in my original post that got your panties in a wad is that Stidham, imo, can do the very same things Brady did in that game. He had potential but he was not TFB yet. No one knew 6 SBs were ahead of him.


"This is not 2001, its a different game now. So you cannot compare Stidham to Brady in 2001 nor the game nor what you think he would do."

Let me remind you the 2000 Rams were the high flying, highly explosive "greatest show on turf". The Pats had a great defense. 3 turnovers. And a great game plan by BB on D & on O. I'm free to have my opinions just as you are. Brady was unproven but BB had an idea that he could manage the game. I have an idea that Stidham can do that, so, yes, I can compare Brady then to Stidham now. I did NOT compare Stidham to what Brady became and has done in his career. Brady is the GOAT and nothing will change that. I sure as hell can hope Stidham does well and comes close, though, and you telling me I can't have that hope, based on his potential, is asinine.

Btw, I'll let you in on a little secret - I've been told by more than 1 person inside the Pats (not media) that Stidham played almost as well as Brady in practices during preseason and continued to improve in practices throughout the season.


With all that said, who knows. I dont, and you dont either. I have heard of the cant miss player, the guy that is going to be great, the guy that is going to take the league by storm...You can watch his film in college you can watch his preseason second half stats, and say man he looks like the real deal, and then all of the sudden, he has trouble reacting to the speed of the game, or he gets hurt a lot, or he stares down defenders, or he misses to the right, or a thousand other things. He could be bad, he could be good, he could be great, he could be average, he could be just a guy. That is football and you know it. Well he has a lot of work to do because thats really what it comes down to, putting in the time and while we shove Brady out the door and start the...well he was only good because of belichick chants that never existed, I know, that he put in the work and put the pats and his team mates in front of a lot of things and never asked for the glory. Maybe 30 years from now people will look back and say, man, look what we had, thats hard to replace. Bash away, I will see you in 20 years when they are putting Stidham is the hall of fame.lly have to see things happen, I dont guess, I look at what happened. Let see what happens, and then you can compare him to brady. Brady already did all of that, stidham didnt, no matter what he looked like in practice compared to a 42 year old QB. I am sure belichick has some great film on Jordan Richards and Tavon Wilson...

lets see where he is in a couple years and then we can decide on who will induct him. I mean we have reached a level of bashing Brady cause of his yards total in a superbowl 20 years ago. lol. Montana had the same in his first too, but anyway, we can compare it to Stidhams superbowl this year and see how it stands...Is 27 hand offs a lot? That seems about average, but anyway. What I do know is that Bill handed the ball to a first year starter on the 17 with no timeouts and said get us in FG range. I would say that is something, maybe not Im sure it happens all the time. I think it showed what was to come, and well it did. So I dont know what this guy or that guy would do in a made up fantasy world or putting players in situations and they would do the same kind of stuff, but so far, one did it the other didnt. So we will see. I mean I dont want to start a shit storm, but I was watching The eagles Patriots superbowl from 2017 and I think Stidham could have coached that game as well as belichick did...

Last edited by Patriots71; 05-12-2020 at 05:31 PM..
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